(MC) Marianne Chubirka

($) Sam Jones

$: I’m a big fan of women’s fighting of all different types and boxing was the sport that I first became a big fan of watching.

MC: You know, the fight you really ought to check out, did you see Jeannine Garside beat Ina Menzer this week? This weekend in Germany Anna Menzer who was 26-0 lost to her. You have to watch that fight because she was so much stronger than the other girl. To me, I think she could have been doing something but whatever.

$: Who knows?

MC: She was just so much stronger, I mean beastly, like oh my god. I realized these girls were beasts. It was a really good fight you should check it out.

$: How was your experience in your last fight? What do you think you gained from it? Obviously you won. What are your thoughts about it?

MC: It had been 3 years since my last fight so the number one thing for me was seeing if I could get to 112 or lower because I know that’s what I have too do to maximize my height. I felt very good, very easy and very strong. You know I wish I had 6 rounds because I’m a timing fighter and by the 3^rd and 4^th rounds when my big shots start landing, I need a little bit more time to get the person out of there. Same exact thing happened in my last fight. By the 4^th round the girl was ready to go. I just needed another 2 minutes. 

$: I only got to see bits and pieces because I had to keep warming up for my fight but from what I did see, you were in control without a doubt.

$: How long have you been a part of professional boxing?

MC: I’ve been professional for over 10 years.

$: As a boxer what do you think are your greatest assets?

MC: Power. I have power. I know a lot of girls when they hit they aren’t going through with the punch. They’re just touching. Even when I was in Amateur, when I punch a girl her head moves. I have an impact. Even with a jab, I was jabbing this girl and her head was moving with the impact. Power and also line awareness. You know what I mean by line awareness?

$: Absolutely. You’re able to see, based on her stance, and based on where your punches are coming from, how to get them where they need to go.

MC: Bingo. Because of my attributes and who I am; I do have pretty short arms.  My reach is only like 60’. I’m like 5’2 so I have to go in while they’re punching and really use that line awareness.  I’ve always been good at that.

$: Do you think that’s a function more of your natural physicality or your technique or just a combination of the two?

MC: It’s a combination. You’re taking your natural propensity and using your martial arts background to turn your offense into defense. In martial arts they teach you defense first. As you get more advanced you learn that defense is offense and offense is defense. You just know to go to what’s logical and take the route that goes strait there.  A lot of times I use punches as blocks. You know what’s logical and doesn’t have to take another move to get there. You can just go straight in. That’s what I mean by line awareness. So if you are jabbing, there are certain things that are open so you can just go right to that.  If you’re short; you use my jab a lot for defense.

$: For catching punches, blocking their vision, things like that?

MC: Well no. It’s timing. As they’re throwing, I’m catching the jab. Then as the right hand is coming, assuming they’re throwing  1-2, when I see the right hand coming I’ll jab instead of rolling under it or doing something where they can counter me, I’ll just throw the jab out there. That opens me up for my next punch which I can take on an inside line inside their punch. All by jabbing inside their right hand. I cut the angle with my right hand.  It’s almost like an upper block but you’re sticking it all the way out there.

$: I get it. Though I’m sure as you’re doing that you’re still keeping your stance tight, shoulders up, just in case something loops instead of coming strait.

MC: Yea. You still tip your shoulder.

$: Thanks for explaining all that. How about this? As someone who has had numerous competitions against younger women, what advantages, and similarly what disadvantages, do you think have come with your age and experience?

MC: I think being relaxed; it can be a double-edged sword. Sometimes I can be a little too relaxed because I know I have such confidence in my defense and really, it’s not that I don’t believe a girl can hurt me, but a 108 or 112 pound girl, the way that they punch, I’m not really…

$: Stressed out?

MC: You know sometimes when you get in there, like when I fought for the title in Korea I fought this young girl about half my age, I was about 40, and I think she was about 20. When you are that young you want it so much, don’t know what can happen, and so have no fear. They just go. On the other hand, I sometimes find myself a little bit too relaxed. But, it works for me as well because I really don’t gas myself and I stay relaxed so I can see what happening and I can just execute in the moment.

$: Ok. Cool, I get that. Let’s talk about your training a bit. Could you describe your training history, as far as what martial arts your have studied and where?

MC: Ok. I started training in 1979 in traditional Okinawan gojuru karate. I still practice it and I’m a 5^th degree black belt and I made my 5^th degree in Okinawa. In New York where I lived, I started competing right away. I had my first fight at 12 years old in 1979.

$: Wow… That’s intense.

MC: Yeah. I have a lot of experience. I probably have had 400 of those point-fighting matches. I was on the US team where we did irikumi, which is continuous contact fighting in which you can’t punch to the face but you can kick to the face, knee, elbow, and takedown.  It’s almost like full-contact but you can’t punch to the face. But realize your not wearing any headgear, and there is no padding at all except for knuckle protectors smaller than MMA gloves. Also in New York I did aikijitsu with Moses Powell and some other cats in Brooklyn, and some aikido. I moved to Florida to teach fitness and karate and that’s when I started boxing and doing Judo. I did Judo for about a year I was really good at it. I won a state tournament in Judo when I just started. I was beating brown-belts and purple-belts. Actually, I probably would have been better at Judo than anything else because my body is really suited for it but I just started so late and also you get a lot of little injuries. I don’t know if you’ve played Judo at all?

$: I have, I surely have.

MC: You know how you get your fingers and your toes hurt. I just liked boxing better and I felt there was more room for me to advance in boxing so I stuck with that. Though I was doing judo and I competed in jujitsu also a bit in New York. I didn’t really have any rank. In judo I think I was orange belt, or something like that.

$: If your beating brown belts, you’re doing pretty damn well.

MC: I did, in fact I knocked a girl; you know how you fight for you grip? Well what I did was I turned my forearm to do an ogoshi foot sweep and I hit her with my forearm and dropped her. It was kinda funny. She fell straight to the ground because I did it like a strike and struck her on the jaw but it was kinda like a little trick that they didn’t see. She just fell down. It was pretty funny. Her dad was a teacher and I couldn’t believe I beat her. My instructor was like wow.

$: (laughing) Nice. Hey, judo is a rough sport too. I’ve seen guys get knocked-out from slams in judo. Judo’s just a really rough sport.

MC: I’m telling you. I really enjoy judo but my fingers and toes keep getting messed up.

$: Yeah, they get caught up in the gi and rolled up in the mat.

MC: I had to choose. I had to. You know when I first came down here (Florida), the boxing guy said karate people can’t fight; so I’m like; glove up. I’m from New York and in karate we fought everybody. We had to learn to fight everybody. There weren’t even divisions when I was a little girl. We used to have to fight boys. It wasn’t boys and girls divisions. We had a division that was age 12-17, white belts to brown belts.

$: (cracking up)

MC: You think I’m kidding. I’m telling you 1979-1980 that was the beginning of everything. It was hardcore. We didn’t have protective gear and stuff like that. You better move, you better block. You better get out the way. You better not be scared because your gonna get it. Anyway I boxed with the guy and I hit him and he just looked at me like, “Wow you can hit hard. I’m gonna show you how to box.” So I started to box and I realized; I used to get disqualified a lot in karate because I hit hard. I just always hit hard and I had that commitment to it; and the girl would be laying on the ground and I would lose. You know?So when I started boxing I just loved it. I was the first Florida woman golden gloves champ.  I had to fight a girl 10-12 pounds heavier than me but that was in 1998.

$: Wow, golden gloves champion also.

MC: Yeah, I was 3X Florida golden gloves champion I was national amateur champion in 2000. I went to nationals by myself because in karate I’m like “I don’t need a coach. Just go fight.” So I went all the way to California and fought this girl. I thought I won but they didn’t give it to me. The next year I went by myself again. In 1999 and I came in second. I made it to the final after winning 3 fights and my trainer was like, ”Damn Mary.” So I said, “Could you come with me next year so I can win? Then I promise I’ll go pro.” I didn’t start boxing until I was 32 and you can only box amateur until your 34. I think now they have a masters division but back then at 34 they boot you out. I would have stayed amateur because they just started having women’s world championships in 2001 and I would’ve liked to try for that. But, they said I was too old so, I turned pro in 2001.

$: You didn’t look too old when I saw you fight a month ago.

MC: Yeah I know. I’m 44. I’m 44. I can’t believe it.

$: You don’t look it. Must be some miraculous stuff you’ve been eating and drinking. Maybe you better thank your mom and dad. Something.

MC: I think a lot of it is martial arts. Just the breathing and many of the things that they teach you keep you young; and I always warm-up. I mean I’m not gonna lie. I mean, my family, they do look good. They look young. But you know, you don’t smoke and you don’t let yourself go really.

$: I mean, that’s just part of being a competitive athlete.

MC: Exactly. You see it. I mean you see Dana Torres, what is she 40 something, winning the Olympics. You know if you’ve been consistent over time. There’s no secrets; there’s no magic; nothing. You think about 30 years of training. I took off 2008. Vernon Forrest whose a good friend of mine; we trained for our last fight, I was up in Atlanta with him and Buddy McGirt. I trained with Buddy McGirt for about 4 years in Vero Beach.

$: Wow

MC: Yeah, but I couldn’t get any fights and Vero Beach wasn’t that great for me. Buddy’s great and I learned a lot but I couldn’t get right sparring. There just weren’t a lot of small people up there. No small people. Anyway. I was training for a title and the fight got cancelled at the last minute and I just got sick of it. I kind of just stopped. I said I’m gonna retire and I didn’t train for 6-8 months; first time in my life. I was just playing poker, drinking.

$: Living like everybody else.

MC: Exactly. Like being a regular person. Then one day I was looking around the casino and I was like I don’t want to be one of these people.  Regular people. That time was very dark and depressing for me and you know working out produces all those endorphins and I need that. That’s my drug.

$: Now your speaking my language. I feel exactly the same. Exactly.

MC: It’s a drug. That was the first time in 30 years that I didn’t train every day. Basically my whole life has been; people say, “Why don’t you have any kids?” because It’s always been, Oh I’m going to nationals. Oh I’m going to the world championships. You know; what’s next? What’s Next? I just really didn’t know what to do with myself, and all the energy stored up inside of you, you have to try to mellow it out so I was drinking and I was just staying up. It just wasn’t pretty.

It’s not good. It’s a blessing because you can get a lot done if you use it in a proper way but if not, and you don’t have an outlet for it, it’s not a good thing. I mean, (laughing) you need to be medicated. But yeah, buddy got me a job as a trainer, and they were trying to bring back Riddick Bowe and I do like to get time with the fighters. That’s what I was doing in Vero Beach and they hired me for that job and I got back in the gym and I felt so happy and so good. I didn’t really know if I was going to come back fighting but after a few months; I said let’s just see how it goes. I started sparring and stuff like that and I felt better than I ever had. You know, I want to get a world title. That’s it.

$: Alright. Following up on that; What do you think is next for your career and is there someone in particular who you’d like to fight next?

MC: Yeah there’s a few. I’ll fight anybody at 112 or 108. Except a left-hander, I will not fight a left-hander as a professional. I want to get about two more fights. I want to get a 6 rounder and then an 8 rounder. Then I’ll fight for a title. If they offer me a title now I’ll fight for a title now but I would like to have another one or two to just get all the way up. I feel like I’m up but just get all the way up. I feel like in another 6 months, early next year I’d like to fight for a title. I’d fight any of the girls at 108 or 112 that have a title, frankly. I’m really not thathip on going back to Germany. I’ve been to Germany. I’ve fought the number one girl over there. I felt I won that fight but it was a close win. I felt I won that like 5-3 in an 8 rounder but they gave her a close decision. You really have to dominate or knock the girl out if you go to Germany. If you go to Asia, It’s not as bad but I would just like to have a title fight where it’s just a level playing ground. You know? Maybe fighting for a good belt like the WBC where you have neutral judges. Something like that. If it can’t be a level playing ground, I’ll go. I’ll go anyway and realize that you have to stop the person. They’re not going to give it to you.

$: Gotcha. Outside of boxing, what are your interests? What do you do in your spare time and what other goals do you want to pursue?

MC: I play a lot of poker. I find poker to be similar to fighting.

$: The competitive nature of it?

MC: Yeah, the strategy, the focus; it’s a good game. I like fishing, reading. Just hobbies. I like to relax. I’m pretty introverted, not that much of a people person.

$: What are your thoughts on women’s boxing as a sport as far as where it’s going and the regulatory nature of it? What do you think about that and what kind of changes would you like to see in the coming years?

MC: I’d like to see women fight 3 minute round fights. I like to see them fight the same.  A title fight would be 12 rounds, 3 minutes per round. I really feel that women’s boxing, they almost force it to be amateurish because of the 2 minute rounds. In 2 minutes, just like in amateur boxing, you cannot setup strategy. The longer the round, the more strategy, the more your going to setup shots, the more if you do land a big shot you have an opportunity to capitalize on that. I feel that is why there aren’t as many stoppages in women’s boxing. You know, normally you’re not going to come out and bang, hit a person in the first second by the time you setup a big shot your gonna land it 40 seconds into the round or a minute into the round then you only have another minute, and if they hang on… Imagine if you have 2 minutes. That’s a long time to hang on.

$: Absolutely.

MC: I really, really, from the bottom of my heart I really feel that would change women’s boxing. That would also change the level of commitment as far as training goes. You really have to be at another level of being in shape to do that. I mean, at my gym, we spar 4 minute rounds with 30 seconds rest. I spar with the boys who are like, “We don’t care you’re a girl, that’s what you’re sparring.” So for me doing 2 minutes, it’s like nothing. Imagine, a women’s title fight is only 20 minutes long. It’s almost half of the men’s. I mean the men’s is 36. When I fought for the title in Korea I damaged her right eye with a punch. I could see the damage but you only have 29 minutes as opposed to 45 minutes for that injury to develop. As soon as that fight was over we shook hands and we took the picture after the fight.  Her eye was completely shut. I would have gotten a TKO stoppage. Anyway. I think that being in the Olympics in 2012 will have some beneficial effects because you’ll have a bigger talent pool and you’ll have more women’s boxing which can only be good. The better the competition, the better the level of talent is going to be so I’m looking forward to that. Other than that, we’d all like to see women’s boxing on TV but that’s going slowly.

$: How have your friends and family adjusted to your career choice?

MC: I’m 44 and I started fighting when I was 12 so if I stopped there it would have to be an adjustment by my friends and family. That’s who I’ve always been. The last time I fought in Florida was 2003 and even though I dominated the fight and won every round, unfortunately I caught a head butt in the last round that cut to the bone. My mom and my husband at the time, who had 50 professional fights and never got cut, that was kind of a big thing for them, just to see that. I think my mom, she gets a little bit nervous but then she sees what I do and supports me totally. But she still gets nervous as a mom. Also most of my friends fight, or are in the game in some way, and guys that like me like fighter chicks. So I haven’t faced too much of that because this is what I’ve always done. At one point when I used to live in New York I was talking to my mom and I said, “Yeah most of my friends are martial artists,” and she said, “Most of your friends?” (laughing) Now I have some poker playing friends but who do I know?

$: They’re pretty much all in the fight world.

MC: Pretty much.

$: I’ve got a little bit of diversity but yeah, my closest friends are all fighters. With out a doubt.

MC: My friends are athletes. Especially if I’m going to date someone, I don’t, I can’t, It doesn’t really work out with a regular person because they don’t understand and so I’m not attracted to them and they’re not attracted to me.But anybody who has been a competitive athlete; football, basketball, they understand the sacrifices that you need to make. A regular person who has a 9-5 and comes home, they’re not gonna understand your life style so I really don’t have to many people like that in my life.

$: I’m much the same way and I love it. I love it so much.

MC: That’s true. You got to love it.

$: If you could fight any one person within the world of fighing, who would you want to fight?

MC: I want a rematch with the girl I fought for a title in Korea. Ju Hee Kim. I would like to fight her again.

$: Well Marianne it’s been a pleasure interviewing you. I hope you get that fight and after seeing what I could of your last performance I really think you’ve still got what it takes. My name is Sam Jones for WFighter.com. Marianne Chubirka, thank you so much for doing this interview with me.

MC: Cool.